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Post by RockBass on Jan 10, 2012 15:15:48 GMT -5
Nate, Mike, and Chris build a Pauper deck live on the show. Listen to the choices they make, including how to take on the metagame, land selection, and effective win strategies. Then they talk about Saito’s upcoming suspension lift in May, as well as initial Dark Ascension spoilers. Thanks to everyone for 40 episodes of tuning in. This is Pauper to the People. www.mtgcast.com/?p=22394
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Post by nyukon on Jan 10, 2012 19:43:05 GMT -5
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Post by yugular on Jan 11, 2012 4:23:30 GMT -5
That deck should be posted in the decks board to discuss!
Also episode 29 doesn't have a thread.
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Post by gabochido on Jan 11, 2012 22:24:35 GMT -5
Just heard episode 40 and I wanted to point out one thing, I believe wizards handed out the god book to a French magazine and it was this magazine that then hired matignon and gave him the god book.
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Post by grumpyoldgamer on Jan 12, 2012 18:01:30 GMT -5
Just heard episode 40 and I wanted to point out one thing, I believe wizards handed out the god book to a French magazine and it was this magazine that then hired matignon and gave him the god book. That's pretty much what I heard too. People have to get down from their high horses about this. A blunder like this could have happened to most of us had we been in a similar situation. It's not like Matignon went to a tournament with the book in his pocket and cheated with it. It was an unfortunate chain of events where information was shared between friends, and somehow found it's way on the internet. It was a mistake and nothing more. Matignon and Wafo-Tapa were banned for it and so were other players involved. And though the bannings were certainly hard on them, you can be sure that the loss of trust and the broken friendships between these guys was probably a lot harder. And WotC didn't come out of this fiasco without issues of their own. A leak like this likely cost them thousands of dollars. I'm pretty sure that there were a few unpleasant meetings going during that week. I wouldn't want to be the guy who took the fall for that one. That being said... I liked the episode. Not something I would listen to on a regular basis - mostly because I'm visual, I like to see things - but I could get behind those things once in a while. I would be curious to know if it would be possible to make the next one 'Live', like on TwitchTV or something. Maybe record the whole thing as usual for the podcast and possibly add a few things to it, but do the deckbuilding part in such a way that we can actually see it happen. Could be fun.
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Post by RockBass on Jan 12, 2012 18:40:56 GMT -5
People have to get down from their high horses about this.. Yeah, I agree. Sorry for bringing up old news.
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Post by gabochido on Jan 12, 2012 18:57:38 GMT -5
I'd also like to play devil's advocate on comments regarding what Wizards has done with the Modern format.
The first comment is that the creation of Modern was stupid and that Modern itself is stupid and that it would have been better to stay with the original extended... or something along those lines.
I believe Wizards noticed that original extended wasn't popular enough for the work that involved supporting it (making tournaments and testing new cards during development) so they modified it. Their new version was even less popular because people didn't find interesting decks to create with the combined card pool so they just went back to standard decks. So now they're trying something else. I'd say Modern is trying to harness the popularity of eternal formats like Legacy where cards remain valid forever (unless they are banned). The problem with these formats is that they are not very accessible due to the scarcity and price of many the key cards. So making an eternal format that starts at a more recent set and with cards that can be reprinted if necessary makes total sense. In general, if you are a company and have a service that isn't working, it makes sense to try other types of services to see if they work better right? or would that also be stupid?
There were also some comments on how stupid it is to create a format and then ban all the best cards.
Unfortunately it is impossible to go back and change the past mistakes of designers and developers that created cards that can destroy whole strategies or prevent new and interesting cards from being created. Therefore the only way to make a format that is based on past cards, but can use recent cards and can have a healthy, varied set of strategies that all work is to get rid of the cards that are overpowered and that means banning them. Have they banned too many cards, possibly but its still just a minuscule percentage of all the existing cards in the format. In fact, by banning a small set of cards, they make other cards viable, so in reality they are not reducing the number of playable cards but increasing them. This is exactly why Legacy has a healthy metagame, because all the overpowered cards are banned.
Then it was mentioned that its stupid to not completely get rid of the original extended format.
I don't really understand that one. Other than minor support in MTGO, I don't see any extended events occurring anywhere. I would say the only support left is so that those that liked the format can play it.
So is Modern a good format and will it be successful? Hopefully, it will be both with time. If the metagame becomes varied and fun and there are enough year round events it will become a more accessible version of legacy (in which blue doesn't rule) and I don't think there is any doubt that legacy is a pretty healthy format.
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Post by dockitron on Jan 13, 2012 9:29:32 GMT -5
As far as the Deck is concerned: It seems fun and If I get the cards I might actually build it and see what I can do with the list for myself.
As far as the cheating is concerned. I hate how people make judgements on cheaters. Cheating is stupid and nobody can stand it. However, what bothers me is people who have never met or even played these guys in one game let alone multiple games are judging them based on what others say. We all know how bad magic players can be with exaggerating the truth (ie: My opponent always gets lucky and I lose, or I always draw horribly) and who's to say people aren't exaggerating about how someone is with slow play or something. Just sayin, sometimes the Magic Community needs to get their crap together when it comes to basing judgements on other people. No, I am not advocating cheating, I'm just saying maybe before feeling you are in a place to base judgments on another's character you should at least meet or play them first.
I personally also like the Modern format and I like that they keep banning cards, it keeps me constantly trying to problem solve and I like a good challenge.
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ANZ
Raging Brainstorm
Posts: 90
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Post by ANZ on Jan 13, 2012 9:51:10 GMT -5
I too like the modern format. In fact, it might be my second favorite format, after classic pauper, of course. I also am ok with the constant bannings, it keeps things fluid, in my opinion.
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Post by RockBass on Jan 13, 2012 13:40:30 GMT -5
Sometimes it's hard to get your opinion on when it disagrees with two other voices. Sometimes it's easier to just agree and move on, as it's an off-topic issue that we needn't spend too much time on. Regardless, I like the concept of Modern. I can't say I actually like the format, because I've never played it. I understand and appreciate the ban list, and have no "beef" with it. And regarding the suspension of players, I honestly don't care one bit about the pro tour, hall of fame, or any of it. But if it's brought up, I'm going to do my best to contribute to the conversation. And if our listeners have an interest, I'm more than willing to give it consideration. The Saito suspension is of interest to me, simply because the idea of putting a person into the hall of fame after a ruling of "cheating" has precedent in other aspects of gaming, like baseball and Pete Rose, for example. In an attempt to be less polarizing on our audience, I will limit all off-topic banter to abortion stance, gay marriage, and American politics.
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Post by gabochido on Jan 13, 2012 17:10:08 GMT -5
I just wanted to point out that I wrote my "devils advocate" post with the intent to discuss the validity of the statements made, not as an objection to you guys mentioning it in the podcast. I love a good discussion and I usually learn a lot from good debating. I also tend to get passionate about voicing ideas when I feel I have a good understanding on what's going on and someone is publicly saying things that I consider to be misguided.
I also think that these forums are a great place to expand on these off-topic things. The podcast has very limited and precious time, so this is a great place for rants and discussions about controversial stuff like that.
Talking about discussion, I'm ready to join the podcast... just say the word.
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Post by grumpyoldgamer on Jan 13, 2012 20:15:02 GMT -5
The thing which annoys me with Modern is that many people do not know about it, many people do not play it, and yet many of those people have very rigid, very opinionated ideas about it. And as a Modern player, I'd like for those people to actually try it and give it a chance.
It's not a bad format, it's actually pretty good. But it's also a new format. It's not even a year old, and it's just going through it's first PTQ season. There's still definitely some tuning left to do. But that's to be expected. And as someone who played Legacy in it's infancy, let me tell you: as a new eternal format being put together, this is done in a much better way than it was done back then. Because for a long time, Legacy was terrible, and Modern is already pretty solid. WotC have learned from their mistakes, and it shows.
So give it some time, and play the damn thing. Because you're missing out if you don't.
My 0.02$.
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Post by RockBass on Jan 13, 2012 20:47:17 GMT -5
So, what would you recommend for a budget player getting in to Modern?
Since I really do want to play the damn format already.
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Post by grumpyoldgamer on Jan 13, 2012 21:25:15 GMT -5
Since I really do want to play the damn format already. Hehe. Alright. The thing is, anyone who wants to start playing an Eternal format will have to put some money down. There's not way around it. The good thing however, is that Eternal formats do not rotate, so everything is an investment. And honestly Chris, that's one of the main reason why I ditched Standard and went Eternal in the place. Sure I had to bit the bullet to get over the barrier of entry, but once I did I was set to go. And contrary to a Standard format where you have to keep a few decks up and running each season to be competitive, with an Eternal format you can keep one or two decks and you're fine. So the cost is not as prohibitive as most people would believe, especially in Modern where only a few cards can compare with the prices found in Legacy. So the first question is: Am I invested enough in this game to make long-term monetary investment in it? If the answer is 'yes', the second question is: How much now, and how much later? Top of my head, right now the most budget decks I can think about are Affinity, Combo Elves, Melira Pod, Splinter Twin and Storm. Boros is also fairly cheap, especially since many players already have several of the Fetchlands from Zendikar. Martyr-Proc is still affordable, but players are starting to realise that it's a real deck and not just a fad, so some of the prices are rising. There's also a few tokens lists running around, which are similar to what is being played in Standard and which are pretty good. Feel free to send me a PM if you want to look into this further. I'm more than happy to help anyone who wants to get into this format. Cheers!
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Post by gabochido on Jan 13, 2012 22:06:34 GMT -5
Along the topic of modern, I noticed there was a player run event that used modern pauper as its format.
That sounded like a good idea for a potential future league format. Since its not something exactly "developed" it would force participants to build fresh strategies (artifact lands should probably be banned though). The commons in modern are all cheap but there's lots of them.
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