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Post by monk1410 on Feb 14, 2013 6:32:18 GMT -5
Hi All
I have taken the Ef deck and tried to make it as fast and consistent as possible
14 Forest
4 Nettle Sentinel 4 Llanowar Elf 3 Arbor Elf 3 Quirion Ranger 4 Birchlore Ranger 4 Elvish Visionary 4 Priest of Titania 3 Timberwatch Elf 4 Lys Alana Huntmaster
4 Distant Melody 4 Gitaxian Probe 4 Manamorphose 1 Mob Justice
The other option I was considering is -4 Forest +4 Land Grant
Thoughts?
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Post by yugular on Feb 14, 2013 7:16:49 GMT -5
I like the Manamorphose tech. It's essentially a free cycler in a deck like this, while fixing your mana for splash. Manamorphose is a sleeper in a way in the classic metagame, more decks could benefit from it I think.
Would you like to share your sideboard too?
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Post by monk1410 on Feb 14, 2013 7:52:50 GMT -5
The sideboard is fairly simple as you dont have many slots to play with in the maindeck.
4 Scattershot Archer 4 Essence Warden 4 Spidersilk Cloak 3 Wirewood Herald
Essentially vs aggro I go - 3 Elvish Visionary, - 4 Gitaxian Probe, + 4 Essence Warden + 3 Wirewod Herald
Against Delver and fissure storm its - 4 Elvish Visionary + 4 Scattershot Archer
Against Post its - 4 Elvish Visionary + 4 Spidersilk Armor
Visionary comes out a lot because you can't take out the mana acceleration or the combo parts. You basically remove a litle bit of consistency for some silver bullets game 2 & 3. I dont think this deck can afford to sideboard too much.
Also a cool trick with Manamorphose. If you have a Birchlore Ranger and a Nettle Sentinel (or 2 if your lucky) it untaps him for free allowing you to produce more mana for nothing.
What are your thoughts on adding Land Grant. Looks like it will make all the cantrips even better?
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Post by yugular on Feb 14, 2013 10:08:54 GMT -5
I haven't really tested decks with Land Grant and cannot really say if its a good idea or not. I suggest you test both versions for 30-40 games and you might be able to draw some educated conclusions from there...
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Post by monk1410 on Feb 15, 2013 5:52:03 GMT -5
Ok so testing proved that Gitaxian probe and Manamorphose did not do enough. They raised the consistently slightly but lacked overall power. I have found a little gem in Commune With Nature. It allows me to dig for key cards whenever I need them. See new list below
13 Forest 1 Island
4 Nettle Sentinel 4 Llanowar Elf 4 Sylvan Ranger 3 Quirion Ranger 4 Birchlore Ranger 4 Elvish Visionary 4 Priest of Titania 3 Timberwatch Elf 4 Lys Alana Huntmaster
4 Distant Melody 3 Vivisection 4 Commune With Nature 1 Mob Justice
Sideboard
4 Essence Warden 4 Thermokarst 4 Spidersilk Armor 3 Lys Alana Bowmaster
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Post by yugular on Feb 15, 2013 6:25:23 GMT -5
How are you gonna battle Hexproof Auras deck? You are pretty much dead after they drop a flagbearer right?
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Post by monk1410 on Feb 15, 2013 6:32:53 GMT -5
Thermokarst slows them down and essence warden buys time. They cannot interact with my combo as mob justice cannot target creatures. The only way I lose is to an early ledgewalker or gnarlid with a lot of enchantments and me not drawing my combo quick enough. The matchup is actually quite favourable. My usual SB plan is
-4 elvish visionary -3 Timberwatch Elf -1 Vivisection
+4 Essece Warden +4 Thermokarst
I am usually a turn quicker than they are
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Post by yugular on Feb 15, 2013 7:16:05 GMT -5
Oh wow. I did not notice mob justice for some reason.
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Post by grumpyoldgamer on Feb 15, 2013 11:39:51 GMT -5
The problem I have with the Elf deck in Pauper is that, at the end of the day, you're only running a bunch of 1/1s. A single Seismic Shudder or Wail of the Nim and you're dead. The deck has no "omph", no winning threats short of Timberwatch Elf. Sure you can refill your hand with a big Distant Melody, but really? If you can draw 7 cards from the Melody, it means that you have 7 elves in play. Shouldn't they be able to do the job by themselves in the first place? So instead of trying to maximize your card draw, why not try to make what you draw better? Why not run better creatures and cards that threaten your opponent's board? Beaters like Quirion Sentinel, Rune-Cervin Rider and Safehold Elite can make for a more effective offensive. You can use Patron of the Wild and Scarred Vinebreeder to pump your guys. You can run a Wirewood Herald package with a few one-ofs like Taunting Elf or Stonewood Invoker, or things like Eyeblight's Ending or Nameless Inversion which can be tutored by the Herald. And general pump spells to end games like Dynacharge, Sigil Blessing or Song of Blood*. The point is that while card draw is good, quality draw is better. *Points if you get that one without looking it up. It's pretty good.
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ckangas
Raging Brainstorm
Posts: 69
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Post by ckangas on Feb 17, 2013 1:53:01 GMT -5
The problem I have with the Elf deck in Pauper is that, at the end of the day, you're only running a bunch of 1/1s. A single Seismic Shudder or Wail of the Nim and you're dead. The deck has no "omph", no winning threats short of Timberwatch Elf. Sure you can refill your hand with a big Distant Melody, but really? If you can draw 7 cards from the Melody, it means that you have 7 elves in play. Shouldn't they be able to do the job by themselves in the first place? So instead of trying to maximize your card draw, why not try to make what you draw better? Why not run better creatures and cards that threaten your opponent's board? Beaters like Quirion Sentinel, Rune-Cervin Rider and Safehold Elite can make for a more effective offensive. You can use Patron of the Wild and Scarred Vinebreeder to pump your guys. You can run a Wirewood Herald package with a few one-ofs like Taunting Elf or Stonewood Invoker, or things like Eyeblight's Ending or Nameless Inversion which can be tutored by the Herald. And general pump spells to end games like Dynacharge, Sigil Blessing or Song of Blood*. The point is that while card draw is good, quality draw is better. *Points if you get that one without looking it up. It's pretty good.Elves have traditionally suffered from sweepers and targeted removal. That being said, both of these are weaker in the format now than ever before. With ETW banned, people have mostly taken out the 1 damage sweepers from their decks. Spidersilk Armor also helps, and is really annoying for decks like WW who bounce javs to kill off your elves, or with goblins recycling death spark. With the prevalence of post decks, there also seems to be slightly less removal in the meta. This deck hasn't been competitive in the past, but it's a "real" deck now. It still doesn't seem to perform great against post, but thermokarsts from the board help a lot. If you're willing to pack 7-8 LD in the board, you can have a positive post MU. The biggest problem is that there's only 7 big threats in the deck, and targeted removal can hurt it. Still, against post and other control decks, an army of swarming 1/1s can still get there. Concerning land grant, I'm actually not a fan in this deck. The thinning helps, but not as much as in legacy (since you don't have the sacs). 14 -> 13 forests is much less helpful than 6->5 forests. Showing your hand is also a big problem against post and delver. Actually, this is against any deck with removal...most of the field. They will know your curve, and know what they have to save their removal and counters for. It allows them to safely tap out, and get the best mileage out of their hands. It can also show decks "hey, if you kill my t1 mana dork I'm screwed". This happens more than you'd think - and even if you have 2 1 CC mana dorks, it tells post or goblins"don't save your removal for huntmaster and timberwatch, just kill both of these and you win if I can't find a land". Giving control decks information tends to be a lot more detrimental than the marginal thinning benefit. I don't think the deck is overpowered, but it's better positioned in the meta due to the lack of ETWs than it has been for a very long time....basically before MBC became popular. I'd suggest that it's a tier 1 deck for the first time in a long time. Of course, this all hinges on the deck remaining semi-obscure, and Kuldotha not becoming any more popular as it is. If the deck starts running into the hate that it used to again (just from kuldotha instead of ETW), it might be back to square one. As an aside, I personally like running commune with nature over probe/manamorphose. Actually, there's only a 3-card difference between your most current list and mine, I don't run Vivisection (I prefer foresee, Amass the Components and sift - and foresee most of all - it does the best at ensuring you don't get clogged with land). Wirewood Herald has also been alright for me as a 2-3 MB. Anyways, the last 3 cards I've experimented on quite a bit....it seems a draw or cantripping elf is the best solution.
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Post by monk1410 on Feb 18, 2013 4:13:40 GMT -5
This is where I am at now.
13 Forest 1 Island
4 Nettle Sentinel 4 Llanowar Elf 3 Arbor Elf 3 Sylvan Ranger 4 Quirion Ranger 4 Birchlore Ranger 4 Elvish Visionary 4 Priest of Titania 4 Timberwatch Elf 4 Lys Alana Huntmaster
4 Distant Melody 3 Spidersilk Armor 1 Mob Justice
Sideboard
3 Essence Warden 4 Wrap in Vigor 1 Spidersilk Armor 3 Gleeful Sabotage 4 Wellwisher
I have added spidersilk to the main to try and make the post matchup better. I added Arbor Elf in an attempt to increase the chances of an explosive start. Also allows a turn 2 timberwatch (or spidersilk vs post) more often. I also now have Wrap in Vigor in the board for post.
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